THIS JESUS LIFE PODCAST

Why Can’t We Be Friends

Episode No. 020

Relationships are difficult; they take time and intentionality and can be the greatest place of pain in our lives. But we are still called to be in them and good at them. Jesus called us to Love God and Love people. He called us to relationship. This week we start the conversation about how to do relationships well. Share your story with us by sending us a message at hello@thisjesuslifepodcast.com.

Resources

Verses – John 17:20-23. Verse – James 3:9. Verse – Luke 14. Verse – 1 Corinthians 13-. Book – The Most Excellent Way to Lead. Book – Love One Another.

Transcription

Josh: Hello. We’re just two normal dudes trying to live this jesus’ life. My name’s Josh.

Andrew: Hey, Hey, I’m Andrew and we are this jesus’ life podcast,

Josh: Josh.

Andrew: What’s up, man. This is. Episode 20 how’d

Josh: that happen? This is episode 20, this like fills out the rest or finalizes the first season. And they changed some things up next episode.

What we change up, it’s still up in the air, but we’re planning on changing things because that’s just what you do, right? Like it’s a nice close of a door and you open a new door and everything’s brand new. It’s like a brand new house.

Andrew: You kill off a main character and you just don’t talk about it. So actually

Josh: going forward,

Andrew: this will.

Just be my podcast.

Josh: I’m just a normal dude talking by myself. There wouldn’t be much easier to do a podcast bar. It would be easier in the sense that like you can record all the time. It’s so difficult to carry a show. Yeah. Yourself, because I liked the, I liked the long rants that we go on and then we just end it.

Especially me abruptly and I leave it hanging and then you’re like, Oh, you got to like jump in and keep it going. I like to be able to do that. You miss that opportunity.

Andrew: I could maybe do a 10 minute podcast once a week alone, but doing an hour once a week, would

Josh: you say you can do, I can do an hour once a week, but I’m not saying it’s going to make sense, be a cohesive thought, but I can talk for an hour about whatever comes to mind.

Yeah, maybe that should be the that’s my next podcast, whatever comes to maybe not, it has to be explicit if I did, if I did a podcast or just whatever, which is fine. I’m okay. With explicit podcasts.

Andrew: Well, speaking of explicit and smart and some changing things up. Dude, uh, how do you want to start this discussion?

Josh: We’ll start the discussion with just a question before we get into our topic for today, which is why can’t we be friends and it’s really why can’t we? Yeah. Cause it’s just, it’s a great song and that’s really why we just stole it. We just thought it fit better, but there’s a piece there’s definitely a piece before you get in or let me kind of preface what we’re going to talk about and then we’ll get back to it.

But, uh, we’re just talking about relationship. Um, yeah, we serve a relational God that wants to be a relationship with us and wants us to be in relationship with other people. But for whatever reason, relationships seems to be really, really difficult at times. Um, so I guess we’re just going to briefly kind of dig into that idea.

And I know it could be a lot bigger topics than just one show and it might become that. Um, but at least to start us out. And the reason that the idea came up is, uh, my buddy here, Andrew is extremely good at relationship. And we just want to pick his brain over the next few moments. Thank you. He’s going to give us all the wisdom, all the expertise, uh, because he is a master relational guy.

Andrew: I don’t know.

Josh: I’m just setting them up. I hear your daughter crying in the background.

Andrew: Yeah, don’t worry. My wife’s scrapping her. She just woke up from a nap and. I don’t know you ever, we went from this waking

Josh: up from a nap.

Andrew: I wish.

Josh: No, no. It was crying to

Andrew: no, my daughter. Okay. Which one?

Josh: Naps. But when did naps start becoming like a thing for like, why.

Andrew: It’s

Josh: just like, we fought them so hard when he got into like school age. Like I’m not taking a nap, I’m not a baby, but like, why don’t we bring them back? Or we’re just like, no adult humans need naps every day, 45 minutes, just a quickie. So refresh for the second half, I think work should work that into it.

You should have your lunch and. A nap time.

Andrew: That’s why they call it afternoon. Just a quick nap

Josh: in the app shall become, which I don’t know if it’s just Mexico or all,

Andrew: like, I think all of Spain, I think it’s just Spanish culture,

Josh: Mexico, the siesta,

Andrew: we really do the siesta. No, but I was going to say, to start us off with one of the questions that, that you, I didn’t right.

Which of us is more likely to wake up from a nap crying. Like loud, like wailing, like you just heard my daughter crying.

Josh: Was it you or me? I don’t know. Uh, I wouldn’t put it past me. Um, now I haven’t done it. I’ll say that. Like, I don’t remember a time I’ve walked up crying, but at the same time, if it happened, I wouldn’t be like, Oh my gosh, I wouldn’t be surprised.

Yeah. So, I don’t know, but at the same time, you know, I don’t, I don’t know how you, I’ve never seen you wake up from a nap. I’ve never been in that moment, which is true. So it might be a regular currents already. And I just didn’t know that. I don’t see, I guess it could go really either way.

Andrew: I th I’m sure it happened when I was little, but I don’t think it’s happened, uh, any time in my adult life that I can remember.

Now

Josh: I have you gone to bed crying.

Andrew: No, no, I’ve been sad going to bed before, but I haven’t forgotten to bed crying. Um, yeah, man, I, I think we, I think it’s semi unanimous. It’s you for sure on that? Yeah.

Josh: That’s um, yeah, that’s fine. We’ll take it. Yeah. Uh, how about this one, Andrew, uh, who out of the two of us is more likely to be an acquire.

Well,

Andrew: uh, okay. Here’s the thing. I think I’m more likely to say yes to be in a choir,

Josh: but I’m

Andrew: terrible at singing. Uh, so I think I’m most likely to be in for a minute and get kicked out.

Josh: I was in a choir. Yeah. Yeah. You were in the Squire. Yeah. Well, I was at two. I was a, yeah, yeah. We’re like choir choir. I was in, I was in it in seventh grade because they had music appreciation or choir and music appreciation had homework.

So I was like, well, that’s out. So I went to choir and I was at the age where my voice was changing me and three other boys. So we got stuck at the very tippy top in the middle of the choir. Cause apparently that’s just where you can’t hear them. I don’t know. Yeah. But I missed our choir concert. That was the only assignment they really had was you had to go to the choir concert and I had hockey that weekend, so I couldn’t go to the choir concert.

So here was my assignment. Instead, I had to go into class or in your classroom during lunch and seeing by myself to her. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Miserable. It’s random. No homework. Oh. Bit me in the butt dude.

Andrew: And that’s, and that’s why you wake up. That’s why you’re more likely to wake up from

Josh: a dead sleep, remembering full on crying, just thinking,

Andrew: Oh my gosh, that sounds that’s a name

Josh: that was just as bad as we had to sing for her when she was like, trying to figure out what.

Range you were, I guess, is the term. Um, and you had to sing in front of the class for that to happen. You’re just like, this is 100% miserable, but now I can sing. So I’ll jump in the choir first, uh, out of the two of us, Andrew. Which one is more likely to laugh so hard. They pee their pants or which one of us has already laughed so hard that we’ve peed her pants.

Andrew: Oh man. I don’t think I’ve ever laughed so hard. I peed as you know, I drink a ton of water. I always have a big water bottle with me. So that means my bladder has just literally expanded. So it might be TMI, but my average PE time is probably about a minute. Uh,

Josh: so that’s pretty impressive.

Andrew: So I, I feel like I have a lot of bladder control is all I’m trying to, I don’t know.

I’ve never been, I don’t know.

Josh: Are you. No, like I’m, I’m a, I can hold my, well, we end these podcasts, the tide, and I run to the bathroom, but I’m still bent over because I can’t fully stand up. Cause I had like, you’ve just like held on that long to not be, uh, but I’ve never paid, but I never really thought that I had a huge bladder until I’ve spent time with my brother.

Who’s it. Six year old boy, you know, he’s not, he’s a grown man, but he has the bladder of a six year old boy. He has to pee every two minutes. Like we’re traveling through New York and we’re constantly stop cause he has to pee again. And I’m like, dude, well then no more liquids for you. That’s that’s going to be our solution.

We’re going to be a child, no more drinking, anything.

Andrew: Eat the saltines. Soak it up.

Josh: Yeah. There you go. That’s funny.

Andrew: Yeah. I don’t know, man. I’m not sure on that one. My gut, my gut says you, uh, I’ve seen you laugh

Josh: really hard

Andrew: a lot.

Josh: Right? Never peed. Yeah. But I, but I will get to that laugh where like it’s, I can’t breathe.

It’s just like little noises coming out at that point. But yeah, nippy coming out. I can hold my bladder. Maybe if you’re a woman, that’s a more difficult issue. Um, but I’m not, so yeah, don’t have that issue.

Andrew: Okay. Last one, uh, which of us is more likely to go a full day without brushing our teeth?

Josh: Well, I brushed my teeth this morning, so

Andrew: I brushed mine

Josh: this

Andrew: morning, but. Dude, I’d say it’s a weekly experience where it goes full day and haven’t brushed in the morning. Here’s the caveat. I always brush at night, but, uh, I look up. Yeah. Cause I’m like

Josh: good night.

Andrew: Like my teeth feel gritty, but in the morning I’m often like I just barely got out of bed.

I gotta make coffee and I’m like drinking coffee. And then by the time I’m like,

Josh: Holding my

Andrew: daughter, dudes, I just missed it. You know? So

Josh: I shower in the morning. Yeah. I usually never shower at night. Uh, and I brush my teeth in the shower. Huh? Um, so that’s when I used my tea in the shower. Yeah. The funny thing is, is I’m using a new toothpaste.

Yeah. I just figured bubbles or bubbles. Doesn’t really matter. It’s all kind of animals, but I use this new, this new toothpaste that has charcoal in it. Cause it’s supposed to naturally whiten your teeth. Yeah. We use that. I don’t know if it’s working. I’m showing it to you. Yeah, they look good.

Andrew: Nice.

Josh: Okay.

But it’s black. So yeah. So

Andrew: like

Josh: what the heck when you, when you spit it out, it’s just black sludge clothes,

Andrew: man. Yeah. Yeah.

Josh: I’ve been there.

Andrew: You gotta remember like part hippie.

Josh: I have no she’s 100%.

Andrew: Yeah. That’s gone now doing Tom’s, uh, which is white. It’s just way less sweet, but it’s white toothpaste. Like we’re all used

Josh: to, um, I just assume you guys are using like actual charcoal at this point.

You’re just rubbing charcoal on your

Andrew: head. Just fight a brick of charcoal calling. Yeah.

Josh: Yeah, yeah. But anyway, but my toothbrush what’s with those, I have one of those fancy dancy toothbrushes. I don’t even know what the heck it’s called, but it’s super slim. Oh, Quip. Oh, that’s freaking weird. What? I just got an email from Quip.

No joke right now in this moment, when I’m trying to remember what the name of that tooth, right. That is freaking, and then emailing regularly, that’s weird. A Quip stopping it. What the head about Quip. Apparently, no. Yeah, no free brands around here, people, but yeah. Yeah. But yeah, no, this Quip and there’s, but the bristles are black too on those toothbrushes.

So it’s black toothpaste about, you know, it’s, I don’t know. It looks really cool. That’s really all. I buy things for us. I don’t care if the practical or they actually work, but as long as they look cool, but I’m moving into a new house. So I’m buying furniture right now too. And I’m really just buying furniture based on it.

Whether or not it’s look, it looks cool. And it’s like, it looks cool on me. Yeah. Yeah. I know since I sold everything, when I moved out

Andrew: well, that’s exciting stuff. We did that we bought like all of our furniture when we moved into this house. Um, most of our furniture, when we moved in here, we bought it through Wayfair.

And that was, uh, that was pre Wayfair scandal where they may or may not have been like shipping children or whatever the heck that thing was Stuart. Don’t cut

Josh: this out. It’s so weird.

Andrew: It’s it’s who knows what the heck is going on with that? So, I don’t know if I would buy all that stuff from them in this moment.

Uh, but

Josh: I believe their response where they’re just like, Hey, industrial cabinets are expensive. This is what they cost. They don’t look, they didn’t look that expensive. And they said poor choice to name them after little girls, which is yeah. Yeah. Um, but yeah, no Wayfair is like, Him and I I’m learning as I’m buying all this furniture, um, is it’s a normal thing of just the furniture industry, but like Wayfair was like a four to six week wait to get your furniture.

And then I went to the furniture store last night. I think it was last night and they’re in the same boat. Really, if they don’t have it in stock, it’s up to 10 weeks before they restock it. And you’re like, Holy crap. Well, that’s, I guess that’s just normal.

Andrew: I guess our stuffed must’ve just been in stock.

Cause it wasn’t that bad, but

Josh: Oh, well, yeah. I want it. I want a big Ottoman. Yeah. Um, and they’re hard to fund. Yeah. Yeah. But let’s, let’s talk about relationship. Yeah. Why can’t you be a relationship expert? Come on. Why? True grit.

Andrew: Not true. I it’s funny. You always, uh, I don’t know that you’ve ever called me relationship expert.

You have called me smalltalk expert, which I swear is a, uh, well, I wear that with pride, like yeah. In small talk with the best of them. That’s what I do. I don’t love that. I actually really. Enjoy deep conversations like you and I get to have in the podcast sometimes deep, sometimes not so deep, but, uh, but yeah, I enjoy that more.

So I don’t know, man, this, this idea of why can’t we be friends? Um, I actually want to hear more of what you were thinking about when you said that, that, but the title of like, it kind of implies like. We Christians aren’t, aren’t so great at being friends with people, not just with other Christians, but with people.

Um,

Josh: and I love to pick on Christians, um, cause it makes me happy. Um, I am a Christian, so I’m not saying like I’m picking on something. I’m not, I feel like it’s like the whole thing. If you’re black, you make more black people. Right. Um, I don’t know if any of that’s true, but uh, So I think it’s a human issue.

Um, I think in general, humans just don’t do relationships well anymore, but there’s something about Christians and maybe it’s just in general to you that we like to draw lines in the sand about things that we just shouldn’t be drawing lines in the sand about. And then we use that as like use the verse of, you know, um, you should be equally yoked with those.

And then we take that verse and we apply it to everything in our lives instead of just marriage. Um, And it’s, well, I’m not equally yoked with you cause you’re not a believer. You don’t follow Jesus. So we can’t be friends. Like I’d be friends with someone that does. Right. Um, yeah. I don’t know. It’s just, it’s a crazy world in, in all reality, like, um, you know, Jesus was very clear.

Like he gave us the greatest commandments. That was the question he got, right? Like. And they’re trying to trick him, but what’s the greatest commandment. And he responds, love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind. And then he continues and says, the second is like, it love your neighbor as yourself.

Now, those aren’t new commands. We find those same commands in the old Testament. Um, but the neighbor piece got redefined in the new Testament. So neighboring the old Testament were fellow Jews. Um, Deuteronomy is pretty clear about that. Other Jews are who you call your neighbor in group group.

Andrew: These are your neighbors.

These are just other people that aren’t in your tribe, literally

Josh: right after, you know, he gives those commands. He tells the story of the good Samaritan, which is the story of essentially of who is my neighbor is the question that got asked. Um, and it’s anybody, anybody, and everybody that’s around you function as neighbor.

Um, now we get into unity versus, and loving our brothers and sisters. Like those are Christian terms. Um, so you’re loving fellow Christians, but, um, neighbor in terms of how we’re supposed to love of, uh, is 100% everyone around me. So it’s my physical neighbor that I live next to. Um, it’s my coworkers. It’s way, you know, friends that I see on a regular basis.

It’s, you know, the people that I see it. At the Starbucks that I attend, that I frequent on a regular basis, it gets all of those things of how do I love all of those people really well. And I think one of the biggest things for Christians is relationship is hyper attractive to people because they don’t have, like, they don’t have deep, real relationship.

They don’t know what that feels like, what it looks like. So when they experience it, they realize, Holy crap, I need it and then are attracted to it. So I think it’s really important for us as followers of Jesus to be really, really good at relationship. Um, and I think you could even call us like the relational specialist or the relational expert.

Like that’s where we should get to that should be one of our goals is as follows. Cause it’s the only way you’re going to love people. Well, right. Yeah. Like you have to learn how to conflict really well. Um, or relationships are going to fall apart. You have to learn how to pursue people really well. You have to learn how to get into deep conversation really well, like all these different aspects of, of relations, um, that I think would become.

Hyper important for us to be who Jesus called us to be. And that’s what he call us to do is love him and love others around us. I don’t know if I’ve shared this on the podcast where I was at a conference a few weeks ago. Um, and the dude drew a stick figure on the board, and then he drew, you wrote God’s name above it.

And he drew an arrow and he said like how at a scale of one to 10, like. What, what level should this relationship be at? And I was like, well, that’s a 10 that’s easy. And then he drew another stick figure to the right of the person who drew an arrow to that person. He said, um, from one to 10, then how deep should our relationship be with.

Each other, and everyone just kind of pauses for a second. And I think they pause because they don’t want to answer what they think it should be because they don’t want to commit to what it has to be. And that’s, it’s a 10, like our relationships with each other should be a 10. We should strive for that.

And I think that terrifies a lot of us because with that. Comes harm, right? Like relationship just causes pain. Cause you’re doing relationship with the fallen being. I’m like, that’s just the reality of we’re both sinful. We both, I’m trying to live this she’s life, but we don’t do it well oftentimes and we’re going to harm each other.

Yeah. So I think that’s the scare of it all. And it’s funny. Um, um, The new, I know I’m talking a lot, but also just one last story and I’ll stop Andrew. But the new OS for the iPhone is out. So I was 14 and it’s on my phone. And you can put widgets now in your homepage. Well, one of my widgets is photos and they kind of just cycle through.

I don’t know how the heck it picks photos. It just picks random photos and thousands upon thousands of photos on my phone. And it’s throwing up pictures of people that I haven’t seen in a long time relationships that maybe fell apart or whatever happened to you or there’s pain in those things. And it just kind of that realization of like, wow, like, like that’s hurtful.

Like that’s hard, that’s hurtful to like re look at these things. You’re like, thanks phone. Thanks for opening up these wounds again. And even in that moment, as I was looking at my head, just this realization, or you could say, Holy spirit, speaking into me, like get used to this. Yeah. Like to live this type of life, to love people.

Well, you’re going to get hurt. Hm. You’re going to get used to this. This is just going to have to be the norm. Did he just heart right? Or put it that’s good swallow. Yeah. You just like, man, I don’t, I don’t know if I want to do that. God. Like some of these relationships really hurt to lose. Um, But yeah, if that’s what we’re called to do, that’s what we’re called to do.

So Andrew, now that I’ve got on my rent, uh, I need you to share all of your expert wisdom on relationships with us. Uh, give us all the ins and the outs. And I’m just kidding.

Andrew: No, man. I, uh, all of what you said was good, that was a lot of different stuff, but all I’ll start kind of where you stopped, but the idea that what you feel like the Holy spirit said of just, um, Get used to this of like being willing to have the pain, being willing to, um, think, being willing to be really tight with people for a season and not so much later maybe, or maybe staying in relationship like.

You kinda gotta be willing to risk it. Gotta be real willing to risk it, to get the biscuit as they say. Um, but, but it’s true, man. It’s like, uh, you don’t and when we say relationships, like to be clear, I think we’re talking more about friendships than about like, this is how to find a wife or a husband or whatever.

Like we’re more talking like just, how do you build real friendships in this life and in this jesus’ life? And of course that’s not just with people. Who are inside the church, people who are just, who are Christians already, but people who are outside or on the edge of it, or totally following a different God or whatever.

Um, it’s it’s how do you be open to relationships? So, one of the things I was thinking about, um, as you were talking was like, Just earlier today. Um, I was in a meeting, um, work meeting and, um, I was on with somebody, uh, who helps represent us to a really large kind of church network. And this networks. Just a lot different than mine.

And, um, they were talking about how, like the, one of the primary focuses of their network in the next like three months, um, is really getting people to register, to vote and to get Trump out of the white house. She’s our contact said we got to get that full out of the white house or something like that, or that sucker out of the white house.

Yeah. Um, and you know, just the thinking about that, like in terms of relationship, we’re trying to build. Stronger deeper ties with this, this person and with this church network. And, uh, And man, we could have been on a call with three other church networks and they might have been saying one of our biggest focuses is voting in the next few months.

And we got to get Trump reelected, you know? And so who am I to say, I sit here and say, well, you know your relationship, actually, it doesn’t matter that much. Um, so in this moment, I’m going to let you, you know, that I’m your opposite side politically, you know, like it’s basically just this, like, can we as Christians, can we as Jesus followers.

Pick art pick our battles wisely because while politics might be fun to argue over it is I like target about politics. It annoys my wife, like crazy. You and I talk politics and we really enjoy that. You know, um, whether we’re arguing or agreeing or whatever, but in that moment that happened two hours ago.

It’s just like, Oh yeah, that’s not, that’s not important for me to like, make a claim on, uh, or argue about like, the more important thing is loving this person. Well, seeing them as my neighbor and saying, Hey, how could we collaborate for a real win for the kingdom? Like in my case, it’s to get more kids sponsored, um, get church plants funded, all kinds of things.

How can we do that together and leave out the side of, well, we got, we got them vote by it and we got it. Trump, we should vote libertarian. You should stay home. Like. No, it just doesn’t matter. It’s

Josh: like, I think it’s actually a vote for Harris now, but both hairs man Biden a couple of weeks ago, flipped the terminology and both said the Harris Biden in administration, which of

Andrew: course they did whatever,

Josh: whatever, but like we won’t get into politics.

Andrew: I think that the, like that ability to pick your battles is something that to me is important in the, um, Just in the day to day stuff. But as I think about Christians and the reputation that we, as the larger see Christians, like in the U S at least we have a reputation of being really great at not agreeing with each other.

Yeah. And then really, even better at not, uh, being able to like, just make friends with people who aren’t in the church. Um, in fact, we’re really good at like, Being branded as like, no, we don’t want to be your friend. You can only be in our building. If you believe Trump should be an office and this is good and this is bad and blah, blah, blah, and Christ.

I don’t know. Like we have all these theological check boxes and then all of these just preference, checkboxes, where we’re like, you can only be our friend if this. So I wonder if we’re in like good at like stopping people from meeting Jesus.

Josh: Oh 100%. There’s no doubt. Um, I think, I think it’s the aim. I think that’s the issue.

Um, even like, as you were talking, I think even more like, that’s our issue, like I think for Christians, oftentimes our aim is that we’re morally right. Hmm. Uh, because we think that’s what good Christians are. Good. Christians are morally right. And we do what’s right. We don’t do. What’s not. Right. Um, and I would argue nowhere in scripture.

Does it say that’s all right. Um, our aim is to love God and love people. Jesus was very clear about it. That is 100% the primary command it’s relationship. Um, so I think what happens is like, as those situations you described them is, well, if I don’t say anything now in this moment, and they’re going to think, I agree with them and they need to know that I’m morally right.

And I don’t agree with them. Um, you know, it’s like listening to, I was listening to a video couple of weeks ago. It’s like listening to someone, share their abortion story. Um, you know, Whether it was before they met Jesus or after they met Jesus, they went through that situation. Well, I have a very strong emotion to that story.

Yeah. Um, probably in a negative way, um, to what happened and I’m not going to get into the whole debate of it, but like, there’s something inside of me that, that wants to jump out in that moment. So if my aim is there’s bad behavior, I have to correct it. So I’m going to say something, but what does all that does is creates more destruction, right?

It does nothing, nothing helpful. I’m not going to change her mind. I’m only going to shame her in that moment. Nothing, nothing good is going to come from that. If I take that position, but if my position is to love her, well, I probably don’t say anything at that moment. Hmm. I just love her. Well, okay. Share story.

Um, I listened to her story, ask questions about her story and just get to know her. Like my response, should it be like, so one of those is going to create life and life to the fullest. Jesus promised one’s going to create destruction. Well, if we’re to love people, like there’s this, I think this is a big piece of like, you know, kind of why for me, why I started the podcast, you know, with you as well.

It was, I wanted to see hope and still with people. Again, I wanted to see people enjoy life as followers of Jesus. And I feel like this is Berta, and I think this is a big portion of it. It’s this aim that we have of, I have to be morally, right. Because I think that’s the goal to sin less is the goal you’re like, when did, when is that ever described as the goal not, I love Jesus more is the goal to love others more is the goal.

And in the process of that. Sure. Will be sanctified. I’m going to send less. But when I try to send less on my own, like, let’s be honest, I’m going to fail miserably at it. Cause I suck. I have no power over it. But when I try to love Jesus more and live in relationship with Jesus, more like there’s a drastic change in my own heart.

And I start to send in areas less. Now I’m still a sinner. Like that’s still true. I’m a Saint that still sins, but I’m like, there’s that piece of it. Then I think it’s just aim. I think if we can change our aim, it’s drastic and, and change our relationship with, with one another that it’s not to make sure that they know what’s right and wrong.

It’s to, I love them. Yeah. And people don’t feel loved today. So I think that’s, I think there’s something about that. That like one probably makes people uncomfortable, but more importantly helps them realize, Holy crap, this is what I missing. This is what I need to feel. This is what I need to experience.

This is what I need to live in.

Andrew: Yeah. Man. I, I agree wholeheartedly. And, um, like, just to emphasize that point, one of the guys, I was talking with a guy last night, who’s in our, um, home church, which for home church, we. Uh, you know, we’re in Eastern Pennsylvania where everything has been locked down, uh, COVID-19 wise for a long time now, you know, but it was like our governor took New York mayor and New Jersey mayors that orders and implemented them right away.

And honestly it made relationship kind of hard to have for awhile. Um, or it made it feel like I’m breaking the law or I’m putting people in danger to invite them into my home or to meet them in public or whatever. But. I don’t know, a month and a half month ago, something like that, we kind of just said, okay, where we’re streaming our churches service at our house each week.

Um, we were having a few people like my inlaws over each week for that. And we just kind of expanded it. We just said, well, there’s these couple families we can invite. And these friends we could invite and, uh, Let’s just start doing that. And the only little tweak that we added was when there’s a lot of kids at our house, we, we kind of rotate who’s on duty and put them all in the basement and they just watch the kids and they do a little kid’s church activity where, um, anyway, it works out.

So really simple model, we just meet, we eat food together. We hang out, we will watch the service. Um, when they’re doing the worship songs, we sing aloud. And then at the end of, of the kind of time together, Um, we just all have a few minutes where we say, okay, what’s going on in your life? How can we pray for you?

How can we pray for your family? Um, everybody shares whatever they want to share. And then we just pray, you know, and I just, if I’m upstairs, if I’m not on kid’s duty, I’ll say, Hey, some, could you open, um, all close? Are you close or whatever? Just popcorn style. But one of the guys that has, has followed Jesus for a long, long time, I was talking with him yesterday and he just joined our house church a month ago.

And he was just telling me he’s like, this has been the most like life-giving church experience. I’ve had for years and years, you know, he’s been in our church for a long time, been an awesome volunteer in our church. And, um, and he’s a great man of God. And, uh, to hear that, to hear like I needed this, this has been therapeutic.

This is reminded me of. Of the things about following Christ that are important, like community praying for one another learning together, investing in another one another’s kids like building real relationship because the beautiful thing out of that prayer question is we spend the next 30 minutes hour, however much time we spend together eating after church talking about real stuff.

Cause we all know what’s really going on, you know? So it’s like, Um, but man I’ve felt that too. I felt it too. Like there was a kind of void in me of like, I’ve, I’ve, haven’t had enough in person time with COVID and just having that even just once a week at our place where it’s an outlet, it’s been really good, man.

So we’re just screwed. We’re not built to be alone in this stuff. And I feel like the bar, like you said, people don’t know how to do it. Bar is really, really low. So

Josh: one key.

Andrew: Pick your battles, you know, don’t, don’t decide like, okay, now I’m talking for a long time, but as a Christian, I think there’s different things where I think like the story you shared, where, or somebody who’s telling the story of their real life, uh, example of having an abortion.

It’s like you don’t, I don’t agree with that. That breaks my heart. First of all, I have a kid and that breaks my heart, that, that, that happens. And it happens so much. And I know there’s a lot of pain in those stories and, um, yeah, but, but you have a moment of, of life and death, right? You can deal a person, a blow.

Um, James three talks about it. Um, in verse I think nine or 10, um, says what the tongue praise, our Lord and father, and with it, we curse men who have been made in God’s likeness. That’s James three nine. Um, so we, we praise God and then we turn around and we curse men who have been made in God’s likeness, you know, um, And that’s reality.

Like we, we do that. We shouldn’t do that, but we do. Um, but there’s, there’s such a difference of like, you did an evil thing or you did a bad thing, um, versus you’re promoting, doing evil. You’re trying to get other people to do join you in wickedness, theirs. That’s way different in my mind. And I don’t know, it’s just like, Somebody’s talent sharing their heartfelt story of that was about sin.

Um, whether yeah, it would be an abortion or something else it’s like send us sin. And there’s a difference between telling your real story and being. Authentic for the first time and maybe a years or different telling your story for the first time ever versus like promoting evil and saying, yeah, evil is really good.

You should join me. It’s really fun. Pop up. You know, there’s such a difference. So pick

Josh: your battles, I think. And there’s definitely ways to disagree with people in relationship. Like, yeah. And I, and we’re not saying don’t disagree with anyone ever. Um, that would be silly. Um, but relationship matters more than the disagreement.

And if. The relationship doesn’t matter more than disagreement. You probably shouldn’t be disagreeing in the moment. You probably should just keep your mouth shut. You know, it’s the whole thing you can even apply. And I know I’m loosely doing this, but you know, when Jesus says, if you’re struck, you struck on one cheek, turn the cheek, you know, turn your other, so you can be struck there as well.

Right? Like. Turn the other tree principal. Um, there’s a piece of that, of like, there’s times that I just don’t need to say anything and I’m going to take the hit that’s okay. I don’t have to defend myself. I don’t have to like, and that’s like, that’s the posture we’re supposed to take. Um, and I just think like, even when someone disagrees with you in a, in, in a important issue, um, like even in those moments, um, If your ultimate goal, if we just play from this angle, if your ultimate goal is that they change their mind about the topic, um, if that’s your goal in life, in all reality, it shouldn’t be.

But if there was, um, In all reality. If you have no relationship with that person, you’re not going to argue it enough to ever convince them. Otherwise you may argue it to a place where they can’t defend themselves any longer, but then that’s not gonna change their mind. Yeah. But if I’m in deep relationship with that person and we have that conversation argument, I have a better chance of convincing of my, my position and that of their position, because they know I care about them as human beings.

Right. So like, even if you took the wrong aim, Like of, I have to be right and convince them that the wrong, um, the methodology should still change. Now I would argue the aim should be relationship loving and caring for this individual. Well, um, and pointing them back towards Jesus. And I think oftentimes we think pointing them back towards Jesus is correcting their, uh, behavior and correcting their false thinking of what is true.

Um, yeah. When we look through scripture, the only time that Paul corrects the church is on theological issues. I’m sorry, gospel theological issues. Um, that’s when he’s really digging into it is when you think anything other than say, if you think salvation comes from any other way than jesus’ sacrifice on the cross, that is one thing he’s going to correct every single time.

Yep. Because that matters. Um, but everything else seems to be debatable. We can land on any of the way him and him and Peter landed on things in different way. Um, it seemed to be okay. The only time that they really got into the big, the big issues was the gospel theology issue. Um, that you’re changing the way that we get to salvation through Jesus Christ, then they’re going to step in and deal with that.

Um, so, uh, I don’t know. I think we make a bigger deal out of, of things that we need to, and it’s harming relationship. Yeah. I can’t be friends with that person because this person participates in this thing. What, like, are you kidding me? Like, that’s crazy. Right. Um, and then just think of her from the exhausting perspective of like, now you’re managing all these things of like, what are they for?

What are they not for? And I need to get to the bottom of this. Um, so I can know if I can be their friend. And you’re like, well, that’s just an exhausting life. How can we just be friends and their decisions making now roughly all my life. Like they can decide whatever they, what does it mean that it’s the decision I would make?

Um, like it’s their life. And I have my life, like we’re allowed to think differently on things. That’s okay. He can, he can revoke vote one way and I’ll vote another that’s okay. Change anything. I might think his way to vote is stupid and obnoxious. Um, but. Relationship matters.

Andrew: Hey, the good thing is we’re going to have yours is too.

Josh: It’s true. Both in the same boat. We’re looking at it saying you read. Um, so yeah, I think there’s, there’s a piece of like, you gotta be aiming for the right things. Um, it’s the in it’s the same model that Jesus showed us. Like, um, discipleship happens, it’s inside relationship. It’s the only way that it happened.

Um, we like to think that it happens from the pulpit. We like to think that it happens inside of, um, classroom style, Sunday school classes, um, and knowledge transfer as a part of discipleship. But it’s not the part of discipleship. It’s a secondary piece to relationship because when I have relationship and I have influence, um, I get to speak truth over somebody’s life that can change their life for the better.

Um, but yeah, like you were saying, like, people are so desperate for a life giving relationship, especially now one because they haven’t had it face to face for a while and too, um, because it’s just their human nature to be in relationship and social media and a variety of other things have kind of pushed us into this corner.

Relationship is just not normal. Or we think relationship is social media and you’re like, well, no, I’m like. As I, as I dig more and more into relationship and try to get better and better at it, and I’m not great at it. Um, but I’m improving. Um, I spend less time on social media because of it. It, it creates this false sense that I’m closer, you know, we’re in relationship with each other.

In all reality, we haven’t talked to each other in years. Um, so like, are we really in relationship? I liked your photo a couple of times. Does it really matter? No. Like relationship is face to face. Relationship is real it’s honest conversation. Um, relationship has conflict and disagreements and that’s okay.

Um, like in being okay. Like I had an argument with. With Stuart who was on our podcast last week, we argued for a weekend about cursing and whether or not cursing was the same. Um, now is it, uh, Important argument, no more entertaining than anything else. Um, and we landed on two different sides of it. Now, you know, my side, if you listen to our episodes, if you haven’t go back to fricking flipping and shoot and hear my viewpoints on it.

But, um, like it came down to like, no, we’re still friends. We still love each other. We’re gonna disagree on it. And that’s 100%. Okay. We can disagree on that. Um, And I just don’t think people feel like it’s okay to disagree on things that they think is morally or sinful wrong. Um, they, they feel like, well, I’m giving it to the enemy if I’m allowing you to live in that.

And you’re like, Oh, I don’t think that’s true either.

Andrew: Yeah, I think you’re right. Um, first of all, I know you’re right. That it’s, that it’s okay to disagree on, on a lot of things. Um, I think it’s really important that we say salvation, that not that we say, but that we live out salvation comes through what Jesus did on the cross.

That’s the, that’s the only way. And I recognize that by saying that’s the only way. There’s a lot of hard lines that are drawn out of that. But to me, I think that’s the most important thing in our, the core of our faith is where to salvation come from. Where does relationship with God come from? Um, and it’s there.

Like, I think that’s very clear in our Bible. Um, and in my experience that’s, that makes sense to me. Um, you know, as you were talking, I was thinking about, um, I looked it up, so I sound a little bit smarter, but I looked up,

Josh: Oh dude, you just made the mistake. I know it. I could have just got to say, like, you know, I think off the top of my head and then just say it, and they’re like, man, Andrew knows his Bible.

So well,

Andrew: it’s actually really good. I looked it up because I, now I forgot the last

Josh: first, which is the most important part.

Andrew: No. So no, in Luke 14, um, Jesus, uh, kind of give a parable of like, Hey, you’re say you’re invited to a wedding. Um, Take a L like don’t walk up and take a seat. That’s at the head of the table.

You know, the honored place, even if you think you’re an honored guest, don’t do that because somebody else might walk in, who’s more honored. And the guest, the host is going to have to move you down. It’s going to have to have that awkward conversation of, uh, Andrew. You’re not that important yet. Can you scoot

Josh: down a few seeds?

Andrew: Yeah. So he says, no, instead take the lowly seat and you have a chance to be honored, um, in front of people. And by the, the head of the wedding, you know, basically it ends, um, the series of verses Luke 14 ends with whoever exalts himself will be humbled. And he who humbles himself will be exalted. And as you were talking about having a voice in people’s life, um, having the chance to speak into.

Hard decisions, the change it’s for them to say, what do you think about that instead of being yelled into submission by you? Like, if you humble yourself on, on most things we disagree with, if you just take a back seat and say, no, I’m going to love you because you’re my neighbor. I’m going to listen. And not just, I’m going to hear your words, but I’m actually going to engage.

I’m going to ask you questions. I’m going to say, wow. Like, I’m going to actually react to what you’re saying in an office scientific way, but I’m going to take the back seat on that argument piece. Well, that bill credibility, um, that builds like relationship equity, you could say so that when people. I have a question of like, what should I do?

They’re more likely to ask you. And the beautiful thing is you can be set up to point them at Jesus. You know, you can be set up to share a story, to share a parable, to, to share something out of the Bible too. To listen and be inspired by the Holy spirit of what to speak into their life in that moment.

Um, but you only get set up in that way if you’re intentionally humble, uh, in a lot of other ways. And I say this, like, I like to argue about

Josh: things, you know, like to me

Andrew: it feels fun often to argue a lot of people, even my wife, like so often I’ll just see it as like a playful, Oh, this is great. Let’s argue about that.

She’s sitting there taking it, like, why are you, what are you talking about? No, like getting upset at me personally. So I got to watch that and I got to like be intentional and how much more if it’s like this close relationship in my life. And I messed that up. I gotta be even more intentional for the time when.

Abortion comes up or voting, or I don’t know, no, a theological issue that maybe the most important, like does the, does during communion, wouldn’t you take the grape juice? Does it become a blood as it goes into your stomach? The actual blood of Jesus, does it not? Does it have to be wine? Should it be grape juice.

Should it be

Josh: white wine? Should it be red line?

Andrew: Well, I like all of that,

Josh: you know, it’s

Andrew: like, dude churches have argued over that stuff for hundreds of years and probably will for hundreds of years to come. But if we just take a posture of like, I’m willing to listen, actually learn, engage, and then I’m building credibility with you.

Intentionally towards the mean of B towards, uh, towards an end of being able to push you closer to Jesus when you ask my opinion, I think that’s important. And I think it’s a key to like, be able to build friendships is like, you’re not just jumping down people’s throat at every opening,

Josh: you know?

Andrew: Yeah.

Josh: Well, as you were talking, I just, I was reminded it’s like I wanted to write a book at some point on pride. Um, cause I think pride is the biggest killer to church community these days. Like I think it’s wreaking havoc and causing a lot of destruction that it doesn’t. And I just don’t think we talk about it.

We think it’s justified in our like we’ve, we’ve justified our behavior using scripture. Um, so we’re okay with, um, Being prideful and in ways, cause we call it something else. It’s not pride, but in all reality, it’s 100%. Right. So I think there’s a piece of it too. Like, I don’t know. I just think of, so the, the, um, um, the famous lover, I’m just kind of thinking, let’s see if I could do them off the top of my head, if not.

I’ll I’ll look it up, but, uh, famous love versus in, uh, first I’m pretty sure it’s first Corinthians 13. Uh, if it’s not first Corinthians and second Corinthians, but I’m pretty sure it’s the first Corinthian 13. So, um, But it’s simply love is patient love is kind love, does not envy. It does not boast. And I think this is a big piece right here, right?

Like, love does not envy does not. Boast is not arrogant. And I think like no

Andrew: record of wrongs.

Josh: Okay. Yeah. And here I’ll pull it up. I read the whole thing, but like, I think there’s a big piece. No, you’re good. I think there’s a big piece of like, Love is not these things. So if you’re doing these things, you’re not functioning inside of love.

I’m like, it’s not, it’s not a love can sometimes live in these areas. Know that the words that Paul use were is not these things. It does not do these things. So if you’re doing these things, I’m not functioning in love. I’m so love is patient love is kind love, does not envy does not boast. It’s not.

Arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way. What version is this be? It’s funny. Those verses, you know, like really well, and you start to read in the version. You don’t know, you’re like, wait a second. This seems wrong because there’s a right version of the Bible and there’s a wrong version of the Bible.

Andrew: It’s this keeping the Bible. Uh,

Josh: yeah, I love is patient love kind. It does not envy. It does not boast. It’s not proud. It does not dishonor others. Its not self-seeking it’s not easily angered. It keeps no records of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil, but rejoices with the truth. It always protects.

Always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres love never fails. And if we’re called to love in this way, And this is what we’re called, right? Those are the greatest commandments. Love Lord God with our heart soul, mind love your neighbor as yourself. Love is the commandment. This is how we do it. So for finding ourselves, living into any of these things, we’re no longer living out the great commandment.

We are living for self pleasure, self protection, self, for whatever other P word you can put in there because the other two are keywords. I’m like. If I’m doing any of these things, I’m not loving well. So like, I think these are verses you should memorize these verses. You should know these are the verses.

You should be running through your head and asking yourself the question, am I loving? Well, and even that last piece love always perseveres. Yeah. Which means you don’t give up on people. Um, and I think we as Christians too easily give up on people. I know I do like 100%. This relationship’s too much work.

This person’s too well, never. Uh, I don’t want to talk to these people, like 100%. I don’t persevere in relationship. I keep coming back to it over and over again. I’d rather give up on it. Cause it seems to be easier and there’s plenty of other people to hang out around. Um, but like the people that are there yeah.

There for a reason. So I should be persevering. I should be, you know, Always trying to protect these people and always try. It’s weird to think that it’s always weird to take these verses say I have to apply these verses to everybody. Yeah. Applies to versus to not just my loved ones, but, but to my coworkers and to people, I just meet on the street in this moment.

Am I trying to protect this person? Or am I putting this person out to the world wolves I’m in this moment? Am I, am I choosing to trust and choosing to trust means I’m trusting you have the best intentions, whether you do or not. I’m going to trust that you do, but it’s also, I’m going to trust you with myself.

So I’m going to share things about who I am. I’m going to be real, honest and vulnerable with who I am, and I’m going to trust you with that. It’s terrifying to most of us, but that’s the life that Jesus calls to live like. If this is how we’re supposed to love and doing the opposite means we’re not loving that we’re living in sin.

That’s that’s the answer to the question like this is what’s it looks like sin looks like when I’m not patient with people. Sin looks like when I choose not to be kind SIM looks like when I’m choosing to be envious, choosing to be, you know, proud, choosing to be boastful, to live in pride. You know, sin looks like when I’m dishonoring others, even if I think they deserve to be dishonored, even if they’re not a follower of Jesus and living in sin, um, Doesn’t mean I get to dishonor them, um, when I’m seeking my self interest over other people’s, I’m not, I’m not living in love.

I’m living in sin. Um, when I’m, when I’m getting easily angered, I’m living in LA I’m living in sin and not love, right? Like these are the pieces that we just keep coming back to that. Um, I don’t know what versus starts. Oh, it is first. It’s the first, first, um, Sorry, I’m just writing these down in our show notes.

Hey, if you didn’t know this every week, we put show notes together. So it’s the verses. We talk about articles. We talk about things that kind of helped us along the journey to get to the topic. Um, we put them on our website, this she’s left podcasts.com. So you can always quickly go back to like, what was that one verse you could always go back and listen to our episode again, we’ll take the list if you want to.

Yeah, please. You can also find, and we also put a transcript on all the things, so you can quickly search for whatever we’re finding. Um, and so having to listen to it, um, but that was just quick plug for our website. Um, but yeah, I think there’s this piece of like pride is destructive and I think it’s a lot more destructive in our lives individually than we realize how often we live into it and how much that affects the relationships of those around us.

Like the reality is if you’re not in good friendship, like people don’t genuinely know who you are and you can’t name off. You know, five, six people that can say, Oh yeah, that that’s, you know, that person knows me. Yeah. Then you’re probably not live in the life. That is Jesus called us to live it. Yeah.

You’re either guarded, trying to protect yourself, which I get like relationship. Pain is extremely painful pain.

Andrew: There’s a reason you felt like the Holy spirit told you got Josh get used to this, you know, cause obviously it’s uncomfortable and extra uncomfortable to you to have relationship and then have it be broken over time sucks.

But

Josh: yeah. And the other crappy piece too, is like, I’m trying to start this community that where this lives. Regularly, like this is who we are as a people, uh, which means someone has to model it, which means when you model it for the first time, you’re going to get hurt more often than the people that come in behind you.

Yeah. But someone’s yeah, I’ll do the pioneer work, right? Like someone’s got to get to, to the Pacific ocean before everybody else. Right. You use a Lewis and Clark quote. Um, it’s like quilt, but whatever. Yeah. It reminds me of the, uh, what’s the movie with Chris Farley and. I don’t know if David spades in it or if it’s somebody else Tommy, like Pocahontas is in it.

No. When they’re like traveling across the it’s, like back in the day when they were like, it was supposed to be Lewis and Clark they’re competing against Lewis and Clark. Oh, that’s good. That sounds

Andrew: good.

Josh: Tell me what that, by the way, Chris, I was right Christ. When I write. Chris Chrissy. I have a friend named Christie.

We have a friend named Christie and I write Christ on a regular basis. She’s going to think of her Christ. Um,

Andrew: yeah man, I, I have a feeling we’ll be talking more about this kind of theme of why can’t we be friends and I do need to jump in just a few minutes here,

Josh: almost heroes, but

Andrew: almost heroes. Okay.

That sounds

Josh: great. As Farley and Matthew Perry

Andrew: almost, I’m writing it down.

Josh: And I’m pretty sure. Yeah. So they’re competing against Lewis and Clark to get to the Pacific ocean. First sounds really funny. And they like run into all these different people, but it is a good one, but I’m also a child of the nineties.

And I think everything Chris Farley did was amazing.

Andrew: Yeah, I do too. Um, I mean, it was born in 1990, so I was kid of the nineties, but, um, dude, I think we’ll probably be talking more about this, but, um, one thing like. Just a note to note to me, note to myself when I listened to this note to whoever’s listening, uh, whenever you’re listening to this, it’s just like, it is really important to pick your battles.

It is really important to think about. Okay. These things are what it means to live in love. So the implicit reality of this is the things that are opposite of that. Our sin, the things that are not, that are sin. Um, it’s really easy to start being like, well, I have the super high standard now of I can never jump in and, um, I can never jump in and like call somebody out right away.

I can never make that mistake. Reality is you can, um, you totally can. Yeah, you probably will. I probably will today after being an after having talked about this a lot, but, but it’s just one of those things. It’s like, it’s, it’s a, it’s a lesson you learn over time and you learn more deeply over time and you apply better over time.

You know, it’s a kind of goal to push towards is like pick your battles and build relational equity with people so that you can point them towards Jesus when the moment when it matters. Um, yeah. That’s that’s what it is. You’re going to mess up. You’re always, you’re not always going to be patient kind.

Um, you’re always going to not boast, you know, like there’s things that you mess up. So just give yourself grace. Cause, um, cause it’s already forgiven under Jesus, you know, just keep pushing towards that next thing and keep asking God to guide you in it. I think there’s a lot more we could say around this.

Why can’t we be friends? So we’ll have to figure out what that looks like. Um, and come back into. Season two, uh, w w episode 21 strong, uh, maybe with this as a, as the theme, but I don’t know, give yourself grace, like with all of this, it’s like, It’s easy to talk about, hard to live out. So, yeah, that’s kinda my close

Josh: and I think the other piece is just be intentional with your relationships.

Like how often, at least for me and my personality type, like when I’m stressed, when I’m tired, I don’t want to hang out with people. Um, But oftentimes, like, that’s exactly what I need. Like, people feed me, like I get energy from that. So I have to be extremely intentional to say, no, no, no, I’m hanging out with this person, even though I don’t want to.

And in all reality, it usually goes really well. Like I walk away like, Oh, I needed that. Right? Like, It’s those kinds of things. Like you gotta be intentional with relationship. You gotta be intentional of building. Like you, you hear this all, especially inside the church, at least in my environments. You do, you know, nobody’s friendly around here.

Nobody wants to spend any time with us. Nobody likes us. And I can’t do anything about other people, but I can do a lot about myself. Yeah. Um, so how am I intentionally trying to fix that? How am I, how am I intentionally trying to get to know people? Like, can I go and invite people that I just met for the first time out to dinner, over to my house?

100% who said, I can’t like, that’s just crazy talk. You’re going to a church for the very first time. You don’t know anyone, you know, a great way to get to know people start inviting people you run into to lunch. Is it going to be weird the first time you asked him 100%, but it doesn’t mean they’re going to say no.

And if they say yes, you’re going to have a great time. You’re going to enjoy each other and you might have new friends, but you gotta take, you gotta take some risks here. Um, be a little bit intentional on building relationships, um, with the people around you. Um, it matters it’s important and it’s exactly what Jesus called us to do.

It’s the Zac model that Jesus used, um, to make disciples, um, you know, what we’re called to do as we look at. You know, the great commission of making disciples of all nations. Like this is what Jesus has commanded us. This is how he modeled it to us. So we should be really good as followers of Jesus, that relationship.

So if you’re not, I get it. I’m right there with you. I’m not naturally good at relationship. Um, but I’m trying really, really hard to be better at it, uh, and leading into Jesus when it doesn’t make sense to me at times. Um, and. For whatever reason I’m getting better at. And I’ll be honest with you. Life is a lot more enjoyable when you’re living inside a relationship.

That’s a lot more fun. It’s a lot more life-giving like, even with people that used to drain me, Um, if I’m intentional in those conversations, they don’t drain me as much. And it’s still fun. I might walk away a little more tired, cause they’re just that personality, but I enjoyed it still. I’m like, Oh, I like that.

That gives me life. Like that’s I think what we’re missing, this is how we get hope. We live in deep relationship with one another. Um, and that’s, what’s going to like, like the dude attending your group, your buddy there, like he’s, he’s found a place where he’s finding, um, life again. Um, and we should be those places as Christians.

I’m not. Yeah, I’m not saying the church at this point, I’m putting the emphasis on you as an adult. It was a follower of Jesus. Yeah. I’m like, you should be a place where hopeless. Um, and this is how we get there, but yeah, Andrew. It’s always good to talk to you. My friend, I know we both have to run. We’re recording in the middle of the day.

We’ve got meetings to get to you, but, um, Hey, thank you guys so much for listening, you know, please share us. Subscribe to us. You’re listening to us on Apple podcast. I think it’s the only platform where you can write a review about us. We really appreciate it. If we see the review on there and we can decipher your username to figure out who you are, um, we’ll send you a gift just to say, thanks.

Um, and the reason we asked you to do this is because we think we have a message that matters. Um, we think we have a message to help you we’ll find hope again, through Jesus, a relationship with Jesus and the sacrifice that Jesus made that restored that relationship. Um, and we want to get that message out to more and more people.

Yeah. So if you share us, you like us rate us all those things, help us do that. Um, and we can start bringing some hope to, to those that are listening to us because that’s really what we care about. We want to see relationship and hope restored, and we want this to feel like a full life, a fun life, a life full of experiences as Jesus promises to John 10, 10, but Andrew.

I love you, my friend.

Andrew: I love you too, man. Thanks for the awesome discussion. Thanks for doing this and thank you, whoever you are. That’s listening in on this. Thanks for listening. Seriously. It’s awesome. They do. Uh, we pray for you guys and, uh, and we appreciate you. So Josh have an awesome rest of your day.

My man.

Josh: See ya. .

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